Ellison unscripted

Full transcript of the March interview for Business Life.

What is the most important use of the Internet? For information or communication?

You mean between communication and gathering information? Email or reading the news? I think it’s both. I can’t distinguish one from the other. The Internet does both brilliantly. For example, in our products, right now we have customers who are using our software to design clothes, collaborate with their subcontractors in China. I guess that’s a communications application. That would have been important prior to the Internet. A clothing manufacturer and distributor in the U.S. can subcontract to multiple shops inside of China and collaboratively design a product over the Net.

Have you abandoned the idea of the Network Computer as desktops have gotten cheaper?

That’s the interesting thing about the NC is how PCs have come down in price…When I first announced in 1995, the average PC price was $2,000 and the primary use of the PC was to run things like MS Word and Excel spreadsheets. Now the price is down, with eMachines, to $400, and the primary use of those machines is to get on the Net.

Is there another career that you wish that you had followed, or that you think about getting into when you’re done with Oracle?

I have a few interests that are in a company called Quark Biotechnology, a molecular biology company focusing on cancer research. It's had some very interesting breakthroughs in cancer research, one of which was published in Science magazine, which is the most premier science magazine in the world. And I’m chairman of Quark. So like Steve Jobs, I have interests and am active in two different companies. And we hope Quark will go public this year. But more important, we expect to begin clinical trials this year with our cancer therapies. So when I leave Oracle, that’s where I’m going.

You won't be frustrated by the pace of biotech development? Clinical trials can take years.

A lot of people don't know this but Oracle is the leading provider of clinical trial software in the world. One of the things we're trying to do with our clinical trial software is shorten the whole cycle from the time the drug is discovered and get it to clinical trials and FDA approved for broad use. Rather than being frustrated, we’ve been trying to fix it -- we’ve been working with the FDA, working with most major drug companies, because everyone wants to see this process sped up. Not just for commercial, but for humanitarian reasons.

So Oracle has a bioinformatics product?

We have a bioinformatics product also, where we work with Celera, Genomics, and others. We’re the largest provider of software for clinical trials in the world. People think of us as a database and applications company, but one of our apps for the pharmaceutical industry is to automate clinical trials.

Well it makes perfect sense, with such large amounts of data.

Huge amounts of data. And we’re trying to get everyone to agree on a standard way to do a clinical trial, and a standard submission to the FDA. And the goal here is to speed the time it takes from when a drug enters clinical trials, gets to the FDA, gets approved, and can be broadly used. And there are commercial reasons for that: the sooner a drug gets to market the sooner a pharmaceutical company can begin selling the drug. But much more important, there are humanitarian reasons. The sooner a drug gets to market, the sooner lives can be saved.

What’s behind the Ellison Medical Foundation’s research into aging?

I have two interests in biotechnology. One is philanthropic, and the other is private sector, commercial for profit. And good work is being done in both areas. Parkinson’s, cancer research in the private sector. And we’re doing very good work in infectious diseases like tuberculosis and malaria, where the biotech companies aren’t really interested because there’s no way to make money. Malaria is largely a third-world, African disease. It’s underfunded in the private sector, because you can’t charge very much money for a drug to fight malaria.

The are two areas of concentration at the EMF. One is infectious diseases in the third world: TB, schistosomiasis. We’ve committed $150 million to that. And $100 million to diseases of aging. And the interesting thing about diseases of aging, as our population in the U.S. ages, the baby boomers, there’s going to be a tremendous economic burden on the people who are still working. Care for people who have things like Park or Alzheimer's is very expensive. Less expensive, and more humane, is a cure. Our goal is to look at the diseases that attack people as they get older and see if we can’t find cures for just one of those. It is not only economic much better, but it’s much more humane. People are living longer, and this should dramatically increase the quality of their lives.

Are you the sole funder of the EMF?

Yes. I’ve committed a quarter of a billion dollars so far.

Changing subjects yet again, who do you picture playing you in a movie?

Steven Seagal. No question.

I think he’s a little fat for you. I saw him on the Jay Leno show the other night and he really has put on the pounds.

Well you know, he’d need to do a little bit of running. How about Steven Seagal of a few years ago -- you know he is a serious martial artist. Get him on the Atkins diet and he’ll be great. Otherwise I’d like to have Gregory Peck when he was 23 years old.

Wouldn’t we all.…

[laughs]

So what have you tried to give your kids that you didn’t have growing up?

In terms of material things, my kids have a lot. But I try to spend a lot of time with them. I try to be…emotionally supportive. I adore my kids. I adore spending time with them. They are incredibly nice people. The thing I value most about my kids is not whether they’re smart, good-looking -- they both are -- or athletic. All that takes a back seat to the fact they are both really nice, kind people. I’m thrilled about that. And I think that has to do with coming from a loving home.

Has your son ever experienced anything that really scared you when the two of you were flying together?

Well my son’s airplane caught fire at one point. My son’s been flying since he was 13 years old and he was flying in his first air show this weekend. He’s a very serious aerobatic pilot, one of the best young pilots on the world. He loves aerobatics. And of course that always makes me a little bit nervous, but I think far more dangerous than flying an aerobatic airplane are things like taking drugs or driving when you drink. So he doesn’t do any of that stuff, but he flies aerobatic airplane. He’s had a few wild experiences in the airplane, one of which was it catching fire. The cockpit filled with smoke and he just landed the airplane.

Were you there when that happened?

No I wasn’t…He’s a very mature kid. And I think one of the reasons is he’s had his flying card since he was 13, and he realizes you don’t get any serious mistakes in an airplane. One serious mistake and you’re out of the game. That’s made him mature beyond his years. He’s comfortable hanging out with and chatting with adults.

More comfortable than you were as a kid?

Not even close. Much more self-assured, much more empathetic to others, much more concerned about other people’s feelings. He’s a very kind young man. He’s not so self-conscious, or always worried about himself. Very sensitive to other’s feelings. He’s on of the nicest kids I know.

Which plane do you prefer to fly?

I guess the Marchetti jet fighter. But I really enjoy them all, everything from the little Citation on. I guess I don’t really enjoy the G-5, because it’s like flying a big computer. It really flies itself. The less automated the airplane the more I like it, the more real flying it is. The Marchetti is much less automated than the Citation, which is less than the G-5.

Have any of your airplanes ever caught fire?

Not yet. [laughs]

No JFK Jr experiences, we hope.

Well you know, I’m an instrument-rated pilot. I’ve done a lot of flying. And my airplane has better equipment than the one in the accident. The combination of a better, more modern, safer airplane and the fact that I have a lot more training than John Jr. should make it much less likely that I have an accident like that.

You said that you want to do biotech when you step down from Oracle. When might that happen?

Not in the near future. I’m at Oracle for the duration, at least until we settle Microsoft.

Is beating Microsoft the only goal that you feel you have left to achieve?

In terms of Oracle, we’re the No. 1 database company, we want to become the No. 1 enterprise application company in the world—that’s currently SAP. Once we’ve achieved both of those goals, we think we’ll be ahead of MS and be the No. 1 software company in the world. That’s my goal, and we’ll either win that war or lose that war, and it will be obvious in the next few years.

If MS is broken up into the Baby Bills, will you feel satisfied that you’ve won?

Absolutely not. I don’t feel good about MS passing us on the way down. We’d like to pass them on the way up.

Can’t blame you for that. Do you agree with Machiavelli that it’s better to be feared than loved, or would you prefer to be both?

Oh no, it’s much better to be loved than feared. Being feared is terrible. Dentists are feared -- the fact that everyone is scared to death in the waiting room doesn’t make people feel very good. A long time ago my sister asked me, which was more important to me, to be loved or admired: the second I said admired she pointed out I was wrong. Everyone, everyone wants to be loved. We kid ourselves and pretend that we don’t, but we all do.

It must be difficult to need that as a CEO, however.

Well [laughs], see you can’t be prevented from seeking love, you can’t be loved by everybody. Bill Clinton, who’s a very close friend and who I’m very fond of…you can be carried away by that, by wanting to be liked and loved by too many people.

Bill Clinton’s an interesting example, but what leaders -- not necessarily in high tech -- do you admire?

Well I guess Winston Churchill, who saved Western civilization in the 20th century.

How about living?

I admire Steve Jobs. Steve Jobs is one of my idols, one of the people I admire the most.

The Titanium Powerbook is really something.

Aren’t they gorgeous? It’s a work of art. The man is a genius. It’s great to have him back.

Do you use Apple products or are you forced to use Windows?

I use everything. I use Apple, I use Palm, everything. I just got back from a trip where I got to use a Kyocera phone, the integrated Palm phone. I use every gadget—Blackberries, I use them all.

If you were stranded on a desert island, which one gadget would you keep with you?

The Titanium Powerbook.

As long as you had your iTunes loaded on it, right?

Yes.

What’s the most fun thing about being CEO of Oracle?

The people I get to work with and meet. There are a lot of very, very smart, achievement-oriented people who work very very hard. I enjoy spending time with them. I have always run engineering at Oracle and I love doing that. I get to meet all sorts of interesting press right now. I spend a lot of time with CEOs of companies that are trying to transform themselves from conventional businesses into e-Business companies, to exploit the Internet in the best sense of the word exploit. I’m working with the CEO of Alcoa Aluminum, to bring their entire business to Oracle, everything. The head of JDS Uniphase, the CEO of GE Power. In five months we’ve helped GE re-engineer their entire business and got them online on 11i. These are part of these projects where we work with senior executives; we never did that before. In the old days, people worked with CIOs and technical departments, and now we’re working with the heads of bus, CEOs, in the transformation that is so important to their business. And there are a lot of fascinating people running these companies.

So you find the business side itself is exciting.

The projects, the technology is exciting. The people are even more interested in the technology.

Time for the Actors' Studio section of this interview. Are there any movies that you’ve seen more than twice, ones that you keep going back to?

My favorite movie of all time is The Natural. It’s the one movie I watch over and over. It’s inspirational. It’s an amazing combination of idealism confronted with reality. You’ve got this very young, extremely idealistic kid baseball player from the Midwest. He’s trying to live his ideal life in a very cruel world. The combination of idealism and reality colliding, and him overcoming is inspirational.

Ever told Robert Redford that you think so?

No, I’ve never met him.

So you’re not interested in participating in the entertainment industry?

I did fund Gorillas in the Mist for the Dian Fossey Foundation. Or rather I helped with Gorillas. I’m on three boards: the Oracle board, the Apple board, and the Dian Fossey Gorilla Fund. So I was involved with Gorillas but no, I’m not really interested in the entertainment business. And again, that’s idealism confronted with reality.

What about books then? What’s required reading for your friends?

I do a lot of reading. I’m not sure I have a favorite books list. I love the Manchester series , a three-volume biography on Winston Churchill.

So new Oracle employees don’t have to read the Art of War.

No, nor do they have to read The Prince. I’d prefer that they read about Churchill, and how he wasn’t overwhelmed by Nazi Germany. Amazing that the morale of a country rested on one person’s shoulders. Extraordinary how people carried that country through its darkest hour. Truly inspirational. I suppose that’s my theme. Whether it’s a biography or a movie, whether it’s fictional or true, I’m inspired by great people doing great things.

And is that how you’d like to be remembered?

[Laughs] I can’t imagine anyone comparing me with Winston Churchill! The man saved Western civilization! I would like to be, on the commercial side.

Right now the tech industry’s morale overall is pretty low. You probably aren’t too worried because you’ve been through rough times at Oracle before and seen the company come back with a vengeance. What advice would you give these young dot-com CEOs who are facing their cash running out in the next few months?

All you can do is every day, try to solve a problem and make your company better. You can’t worry about it, you can’t panic when you look at the stock market’s decline. You get frozen like a deer in the headlights. All you can do is all you can do. If your cash is about to run out you have to cut your cash flow. CEOs have to make those decisions, and live with it, however painful they might be. You have to act and act now, and act in the best interests of the company as a whole, even if that means that some people in the company who are your friends have to work somewhere else.

I saw that Oracle has announced layoffs.

It’s interesting you saw that, because we haven’t decided that yet. It’s a terrible time. We’ve frozen hiring, but in fact we haven’t made that decision yet. Last quarter, in a difficult economy, our margins went up from 31 to 33 percent and we had record profits. Compared to other companies we had a really good quarter.

The cost savings Oracle has made are pretty amazing.

Right! And we have fewer people working at Oracle than ever before.

What happens to all your old suits?

[Laughs] I’m very fortunate that I have several people in my family who are approximately my size! And my "old" suits aren’t very old. They get passed down.

And who’s your favorite designer of the moment?

For men’s clothes? I buy my clothes from a small tailor in Naples called Attolini, and a larger tailor in Milan called Brioni. Attolini is primarily a custom tailor.

And your shoes?

Edward Green in London.

I presume that the people in your family don’t wear your same shoe size?

No, they don't. My shoes go nowhere.

Are there any particular sayings or proverbs that you’re fond of?

There are a lot. There’s a famous Chinese proverb that predictions are very dangerous especially where they pertain to the future.

I guess mine would be the curse may you live in interesting times.

That, too.

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